Dodge Challenger Hellcat Redeye Widebody review - practical depravity

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They should call it the Wide-eye because that’s what happens when the throttle is pinned to the floorboard. The 797 horsepower Dodge Challenger Hellcat Redeye is basically a “detuned” Dodge Demon engine with some carryover features in a Hellcat Widebody. The Redeye option has specific hood scoops and is the ultimate styling version of the Challenger lineup. It looks like an extra-large Trans-Am racer from the early 70s. Bulging fenders with 305 series tires front and rear gives it a sinister and powerful appearance in the Destroyer Grey color.

What matters most is under the hood. The remote start takes several seconds to go through the process and suddenly the car erupts in a surprisingly loud-for-stock, purposeful rumble. How it’s legal in the big nanny state is anyone's guess. But it’s glorious and gets the blood pumping and smiles broadening in anticipation.

It starts in the “Eco” mode which means “only” 500 horsepower, matching the 'Black' key of the two provided as opposed to the "Red" key which unlocks the full power potential.  In the Black key mode, it also shows conservative settings for the transmission, traction control, suspension and steering.  Paddle shifters are disabled and the beast defaults to 2^nd gear starts. Push the SRT button on the dash and the menu selections of Track, Sport, and Custom modes are available to get you out of Eco oppression.

Things go "red" when the other modes are selected and the exhaust gets louder. The headlining moment of this car is when you hit the gas. From a roll, whether at low speed or 55mph, all hell, and rear  tires, break loose. The transmission’s near instant response combined with the engine output is a reality altering event in such a big vehicle. One of multiple passengers, a fan of the NHRA, hot rods and once my passenger at a media track day described it as “surreal” as well as some other choice words. And this tire spinning phenomenon can and did happen with multiple occupants. It’s loud, furious and amazingly powerful. 

Another example is one time it was in the 500hp mode with four adults in the car. I punched it and I heard the “Whoa” as you’d expect from all three. But when the 797hp mode was activated, that’s when the resulting acceleration pull caused all our heads to lean back from the g-force generated and the “Whoa” changed to a much louder, “Wows!” with giggles.  Or the little nephew yelling with joy, hands raised like on a roller coaster. It’s all exhaust roar and supercharger whine.

Included in the $6000 Widebody package is wider tires mentioned front and rear on 11” width, 20” tall wheels. It also includes their "Competition" suspension and the fender flairs. Internet experts complain about its size and weight.  Find another 10 second quarter-mile, 130mph+ trap speed coupe that seats four adults. And is it under $100k? They also claim the platform was old in 2009. It’s since been heavy revised and updated, and obviously still relevant so again, meaningless. Some harp on the reliability rankings. SRT has been excellent for over a decade, personal experience. And the Bondurant Racing School loves the reliability of theirs.  Bob, his wife Pat and one of the technicians we talked to all love them. To the point the techs had less work and they had to be promoted within to be instructors to keep them on staff. But yes, it is heavy and large, but so are virtually all four adult passenger coupes. At over 4,500 lbs though, it needs to lose nearly 1000lbs to be a regular track day (road circuit) choice.

But that’s not to say it doesn’t have flaws. On a 150 mile road trip, the exhaust drone is noticeable for those acclimated to silent luxury, and unfortunately it won’t upshift into 8^th, the top gear unless in Eco mode or manually selected. If in a performance mode, it drops out of 8^th easily and won’t return automatically. A software update could fix that. The driver’s seat has some electrical adjustments but the lumbar support seemed a little too intrusive. The passenger seat only had manual adjustments. Some may not care, but with the practicality-implying multiple-passenger transport, expecting more content for $90,000 is reasonable. Ever since 2006, various SRT, Scat Pak, R/T, Daytona, 392 and Hellcats didn’t have the lumbar bulge I could recall, but the thick seats do cut into the rear leg room a bit. A non-issue in the sedans, and in the coupe, even though four adults can fit, and better than the domestic Mustang and Camaro competitors, the seats should automatically power forward when the seatback is tilted forward.

Despite the seating shortcomings, this one has automatic high beams, rain sensitive wipers, blind spot and rear cross-path detection, remote start as mentioned, and the Uconnect infotainment interface with GPS and Sirius XM radio for 1 year, Traffic Plus and Sirius Travel Link for 5 years. Unfortunately it also has a $1,700 gas guzzler tax due to the 13 mpg city and 22 mpg highway ratings. Due to multiple exhibitions of acceleration for friends and neighbors, who absolutely loved the experience, 9mpg was indicated at one point.

Never mind these electrical luxury features, content and complaints of a nearly 800hp car on pump gas that has a factory warranty, California smog legal and costs under $100,000. Let’s get back to the basics. The width can be felt in the handling, which is secure and a firm, and handles bumps very well. The suspension tuning is great for its sheer size and mission intent. Interestingly the perception of width is apparent in that the body motions felt like they were from “the other side” versus right next to you. As if you sit far from its vertical axis. Never mind all that, the emersion in performance gets deeper still….

The Performance Pages is the where the data and telemetry lies. The home screen gauges show horsepower, boost pressure, g-force and a 0-60mph timer. The second page is the transmission temp, boost pressure, air-fuel ratio, intake charge coolant temp, and intake air temp on the third page. The performance timers include reaction time, 0-60mph, 0-100mph, 1/8th mile elapsed time, 1/8th mile mph, 1/4 mile elapsed time, 1/4 mile mph, and braking distance from the recorded mph. The gauge screen shows oil temperature, oil pressure, coolant temperature and battery voltage. There’s a g-force screen showing a levels achieved in all directions, an engine output summary and dyno summary of horsepower and torque.

For putting the rubber to the ground, it offers a line-lock for warming up the rear tires and an adjustable rev limiter for launch rpm selection.  Speaking of which, there’s an interesting parallel with the Corvette. This is may be the pinnacle of straight line performance for the Challenger.  As long as it is front engine and rear drive, it will have that fundamental traction problem with street tires on an unprepped track. And now the Corvette is moving to a rear mid-engine design for better rear tire traction, not to mention the braking and aerodynamics benefit. That won't happen with the Challenger though. 

Other equipment for performance includes 41-spline, 230mm, heavy duty half-shafts in the rear to withstand the 707lbs ft torque from the engine being transferred to the wheels. To cool the incoming air to make maximum power, it offers the Power Chiller first seen on a production car from the Demon, which uses the air conditioner to further chill the supercharger coolant, which reduces the air temperature. The After-Run Chiller uses the cooling fan and a coolant pump to circulate the coolant to help cool the engine between runs at the dragstrip for optimal power.

in the price range of a base price of $58,995 for the 717hp Hellcat to the loaded, 797hp Redeye, they are an old-school throwback to straight line performance with well above-average handling despite its size and weight. It’s an amusement park ride for a family of four, driving it every time is an event, not a routine. As the Redeye sits alone in its combination of practicality, performance and price range, is it already a legend?

The Dodge Demon is not banned and other facts

It’s time to straighten out the misconceptions, ignorance and fake news about the Dodge Demon. Dodge conducted an extensive marketing campaign to introduce the Dodge Challenger based Demon. There was much speculation but the bottom line is it is the quickest production car ever made, only potentially beaten by the all-wheel drive Bugatti Chiron. Further furor struck when Dodge announced the NHRA letter this Demon was banned from their tracks because it was too quick and too fast without a roll cage. Notice the letter stated “this vehicle”.  There is no blanket ban on the Dodge Demon at NHRA member tracks.

There are no letters about the Veyron, La Ferrari, Porsche 918 and McLaren P1? That’s because despite their potential to exceed the NHRA 2008 model year production car limit of a 135mph trap speed or 10.0 second ET, those numbers have to be exceeded and witnessed at an NHRA member track first before the singular, observed vehicle is banned. And not a blanket ban. Not every driver of those cars will exceed those limits and who’s to say they can’t back off in order to stay eligible? Happens all the time with other built cars.

Let’s look at the demonic numbers. The pump gas, emissions legal horsepower rating is 808hp and 717 lbs ft torque. With the optional 100 octane race gas tune Engine Control Unit (ECU), those levels go up to 838hp and 770 lbs ft torque. The race gas tune does not void the powertrain warranty of 5 years or 60,000 miles either. This optional ECU equipped Demon ran a 9.65 ET at 140mph quarter mile with a 2.3 second 0-60mph time, all NHRA certified. It also has a production car record wheelie distance of 2.92 feet per Guinness World Records. However Motor Trend reported the new Porsche 911 Turbo S also lifts its front wheels.

The stock tires are Nitto drag radials (DRs), 315/40/18s, front and rear. Of course they are not recommended for temperatures below 15 degrees but that is the case with virtually every summer tire designed for maximum fair weather grip as opposed rain, snow, etc. While many scoff at the choice of DRs, there are plenty of users on the internet that report using them during track days on road circuits with the appropriately raised air pressure. Surprise! Dodge reports a 60-0 braking distance of a world class 97 feet as well.

This is not just a supercharger pulley swapped Hellcat. It has a larger supercharger, upgraded connecting rods, pistons, and valvetrain as part of 25 upgraded engine components. It also has a higher stall torque converter, more aggressive final drive ratio and twin dual-stage fuel pumps. The only transmission, an 8 speed automatic, has been strengthened along with an upgraded drive shaft, rear axle and larger half shafts. There is also equipment specific to drag racing such as a Line Lock which allows the rear tires to spin with the front brakes engaged in order to warm them up for more traction off the line. The Mustang GT was the first production car with this feature.

There are some production car firsts. One is a transbrake that engages first gear and second gear simultaneously to allow the engine to build supercharger boost for more power during the launch. Aftermarket transbrakes engage first and reverse, but in case of a failure of first gear, the Demon won't suddenly go backwards. A clever step in avoiding potential liability. An "After cooler" uses air conditioning coolant in a chiller system to drop the intake air temperature up to 45 degrees to make sure the engine produces optimum power, more consistently, and offset the power robbing effect of hot weather. It also helps cool the engine after a run as well. There is a torque reserve system that builds supercharger boost in preparation for a hard launch with the transbrake.

The front shocks are designed to allow for front end lift under acceleration for better weight transfer to the rear while the rear shocks have firm compression and damping for optimized rear traction. The traction control is also optimized for acceleration and stability control kicks in if the vehicle is no longer traveling straight, further shutting down the jokes about being wrecked immediately leaving Cars and Coffee events.

There are equipment packages available with the Demon which has an MSRP of $84,995 by itself. You can add air conditioning and a radio. Otherwise two speakers are standard, required for seatbelt and key in the ignition chimes. However the two most discussed options cost $1 each. The first one is passenger and rear seats. The second one is a tool crate that includes the aforementioned ECU, skinny front wheels but not the tires, a floor jack and electric impact wrench for removing and installing the wheels. It also includes a tire pressure gauge, fender cover and a tool bag, most of which supplied by Snap-On.

The Challenger platform, while large and heavy, is still relevant today. Can you think of another coupe with room for four that has, say, six hundred horsepower or more than weighs less? What about under $100k? What Dodge has done is for the history books. There has never been a car like the Demon, and in the age of hybrids, environmental concerns, electrification, and more; there will probably never be anything like it again that is street legal. Well done Dodge, you’ve created a modern legend.

For an even more in-depth summary of the equipment levels and features, check out this link:

http://www.newson6.com/story/35127512/2018-dodge-challenger-srt-demon-pulls-the-wheels

Photos courtesy of FCA US media:

Porsche Panamera - why is it so quick?

Three letters in the March 2010 Car & Driver question the 3.3 second 0-60mph time of the Porsche Panamera Turbo that was tested the December 2009 issue. That makes it potentially quicker than many cars with much more power and less weight including the McLaren F1, Ferrari Enzo and Porsche's own GT-2. Weighing 4409lbs with 500hp, on paper it shouldn't beat any of them. There are three reasons it's so quick.

All-wheel drive, the dual clutch transmission and gearing that is probably more aggressive than any performance car in history make it accelerate quicker than much more powerful and lighter cars. The Panamera Twin Turbo is in 3rd THIRD! gear by the time it hits 60mph. Many extreme cars like the Bugatti Veyron, Chevrolet Corvette ZR-1 and others go over 60mph in 1st gear. Check out the Bugatti Veyron road test with the top 10 quickest cars they have tested.

The all-wheel drive ensures no slippage unlike the others where power delivery has to be managed with available traction. I eluded to this challenge in my 60-130mph article. A 1.2 second 0-30mph time is extraordinary, on par with the AWD Veyron and GT-R. I would guess this translates to a 1.6 second 60ft at the dragstrip given the previously mentioned gearing.

The horsepower deficit is apparent in the trap speed in the 119mph range vs. the 125-130mph or higher times of the other cars. With excellent track preparation, technique and usually drag radial tires, a few have been able to match the launch of the Panamera and therefore run a much quicker quarter mile. Modern-day street car drag racing legends such as "Ranger" and "Furman" are examples of Corvette and Viper drivers who have done this.

Finally the 7-speed dual-clutch transmission means nearly uninterrupted power delivery. As one clutch disengages, the next engages with a speed and consistency that can't be humanly repeated. With 5 non-overdrive gears, it's fierce.

There is no other-worldly driving skill excuse or strongly suspect fudging of power levels in any gear with the Porsche Panamera Twin Turbo, unlike the Nissan GT-R. The car doesn't defy physics but it's transmission sure tries to make it seem so. Just wait when the new 911 Twin Turbo is tested.

The 2010 Porsche 911 Twin Turbo assuming the gearing is the same as the Panamera is that it will accelerate even quicker since it's about 800lbs lighter than the Panamera. So besides still not matching the GT-R's "factory" 'Ring time, it still won't accelerate to 130mph 1.6 seconds quicker than production models nor accelerate from 120 to 130mph in .9 seconds either in production form.

A great link for various automotive calculators courtesy of Wallace Racing. There are several for 60ft translations and various speed indicators.
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Have a question about cars you would like answered? Want to know about performance, racing, modifying, shopping, makes, models, events, etc? Ask me here: AskRobAboutCars@gmail.com and I'll do my best to answer your question and publish it here on Examiner.com!

More About: drag racing · performance · Car and Driver · racing · GM · Ferrari · Corvette · Nissan · Porsche · Panamera · Dodge · Veyron · Chevrolet · Viper · cars · Lamborghini · Ask Rob About Cars

Ask Rob About Cars 9-27-09 Domestic Performance Sedan

Question: Hey man, I currently have an '05 LS2 GTO (in manual) and next year, I was looking into getting something else frivolous like a Corvette. But recently, I've really started to get tired of sitting in traffic with the GTO's s****y shifter (I have the ripshift but am constantly having to take it all apart and reloctite s**t), and the shot stock suspension. On top of that, the GTO's small trunk and pain-in-the-ass rear seat access has really started to bug me. And lastly, I am starting to give real thought to the possibility of having an auto in my next car. We go out with our friends quite a lot these days, and I usually can't drink because I end up driving, and the wife can't drive stick, and further has no desire to learn. Like, at all. So, my next car, I'm thinking needs to be something she can drive.

NOW THEN. This thinking led me to a series of needs for my next car (which by the way, my budget is $35,000 max):- Big trunk- Four doors- big honking American V8- Still needs to be pretty fast (in my past, I've gone from a Terminator cobra to a Mini Cooper S, I'll never make THAT mistake again)- all around useable space but still pretty quick, and fairly easy to mod.- needs to be an auto so the wife can drive it.So, with all these paremeters in mind, there were really only four or five cars that came to mind as possibilities:

1. Last gen CTS-V. The horror stories surrounding the rear end were enough to instantly disqualify this car.
2. G8 GT/GXP. GXPs are still going for massive cash, and the GT's interior is appalling. Typical GM plastic b******t. Everything else was what I needed, I just can't go back to a chintzy interior.
3. So that leaves me with the SRT8 Charger or 300 SRT8 as possibilities. I am strongly leaning towards the 300 SRT8s, which brings me to the main question: can you give me any information about these cars? I don't want to join an SRT board because they're really biased.

Moddability? How well do bolt-ons do for the car? (no FI or head/cam) Readers: This means no forced induction (turbo or supercharger) or cylinder heads and camshaft. Both are more expensive, extensive and significant "power adders".

RELIABILITY? The GTO is reliable, that is, the ENGINE is reliable, but the suspension is pure s**t, and I don't want another car I need to replace every single godd**n part on for it to be decent.

Is there a big trunk? Is there a pass-through for long items?- How does the back seat compare?- Is the auto a five or six speed?- Anything I should watch out for when looking at a used one (either Charger or 300)Thanks man.- SS

ANSWER: Hey SS, thank you for your inquiry.

The options you list with your requirements are all viable, except the 1st generation CTS-V is only available in a 6-speed manual. Interestingly, the G8 owners seem to like their interiors but really it's a matter of preference. What may not look so hot may feel and operate pretty well.

Modability: The 425hp 6.1 liter in the SRT-8s respond very nicely to bolt-on modifications and with a cold-air intake, a cat-back exhaust system and a dyno tune with a handheld tuner from Diablosport you can expect over 400 rear wheel horsepower (rwhp) on 91 octane gas. Bone stock they usually dyno at 355 to 375rwhp. Besides other tuning options, the revised shifting into 2nd and 3rd due to the reduced torque management really wakes the car up. Trap speed in the quarter mile increase 3-4 mph to maximum of 114mph and capable of ETs in the 12.6 to 12.7 range depending upon the sixty-foot time.

Reliability - Is quite satisfactory among thousands of owners. A potential sunroof rattle may exist and the excessive brake dust and radiator fluid odor have most likely been already addressed by a previous owner or non-existant on the newer models.

The trunk space is excellent and very deep and the rear seats do fold down for a pass through. Two adult-sized bicycles can fit with the trunk closed provided you take off the front wheels.

Rear seat room is also quite good and seats 2 adults comfortably and 3 isn't too bad either. Keep in mind the LX platform has a 120" wheelbase which is huge by most standards and makes for a lot of interior and cargo space.

The Mercedes sourced 5speed automatic is quite stout and despite the current 13 city / 18 highway rating, you'll see 20+mpg at 70mph stock and 22-23mpg when tuned. Figure 13mpg in the suburbs with a heavy foot. There are "deadspots" in 2nd and 3rd gear so knowing the powerband is important if hard acceleration is wanted going from a roll. The car is quicker if you let it upshift itself. However, downshifting is fun only after doing exhaust work.

It should be noted the suspension is stiffer on the Charger and handles noticably better than the 300 (body roll and jounce) but doesn't have quite as nice as an interior. The '08s have revised shocks for less harshness. The Brembo calipers are red on the Chargers, silver on the 300s.

Things to look out for when buying one are the same as any other car - crash damage, paintwork, etc. The owners of the SRT-8s tend to be maticulous enthusiasts so maintenance records may be provided besides what was done at the dealer. Going back to previous mentions, check the radiator fluid in the overflow tank to see if there is any debris. Brake rotors should be slotted (per a technical service bulletin) for prior year models and once warmed up, if it shifts from 1st to 2nd by itself despite being in "manual" mode. That is the preference because the tachometer and response to the autostick doesn't match the actual engine rpms and bouncing off the rev limiter is a frustrating result. The factory navigation system is very good but not a touch screen.

I highly recommend the 300cforums and Chargerforums along with the LXforums for vast technical knowledge, how-tos, a timeslip database and an added bonus, SRT-8 Engineer Chat Sessions that occur monthly on the first two.

Whichever you choose, you'll love it. Let me know if you have further questions.

Got a question about cars you would like answered? Performance, racing, modifying, shopping, makes, models, events, etc? Ask me here: AskRobAboutCars@gmail.com and I'll do my best to answer your question and publish it here on Examiner.com!

The proper comparison of Pony Cars

Only AutoWeek (AW) did the proper comparison of the current Pony Cars. The testers don't drive very well, but they trumped Motor Trend and Car & Driver. The June 15th issue of AW featured a comparison test of the new Chevrolet Camaro SS, Ford Mustang Shelby GT500 and Dodge Challenger SRT-8. http://www.autoweek.com/article/20090612/CARNEWS/906129990

Why is this test better than rest? It isn't because of the performance results, it's because they compared the top-of-the-line models from each manufacturer. Car & Driver didn't do it right in the July 2009 issue: http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/comparison_test/coupes/2010_chevy_camaro_ss_vs_2010_ford_mustang_gt_2009_dodge_challenger_r_t_comparison_test

and neither did Motor Trend in the June 2009 issue: http://www.motortrend.com/multimedia/wallpaper/112_0906_2010_camaro_2009_challenger_2010_mustang_wallpaper/index.html

Before I get into the problem with the performance numbers, what is overlooked is market segment vs. pricing. When shopping for over $30k domestic performance coupes, the enthusiast is going to shop capability first, price second. These magazines are bringing existing models to a test with the new Camaro SS. Since the SS is the top performer in the Camaro model line-up, don't bring the Challenger R/T, bring the SRT-8. Doesn't it make sense to see how a 426hp Chevy does against a 425hp Dodge? The Mustang GT, at 315hp, doesn't belong either. Bring the 540hp GT500. So what if the GT500 is nearly $51k. The Camaro is $37k and the Dodge nearly $44k.

Yes, the Camaro is a bargain, but a used GT500 is in the same range. And the Challenger SRT-8 new or used, is close enough as well. So again, AW did the right thing by comparing a the top models to each other.

What about the driving? Well in the simplest terms, when the 425hp Dodge is clocked from 0-60mph in 5.7 seconds, that is garbage. Literally. Especially when other sources are clocking the 376hp R/T version in 5.1 seconds. If the car is faulty, get another from the press pool or at least tell us the quarter-mile results. All of models tested in AW are capable of mid/high 4-second blasts. And that is only part of the story.

The 0-60mph test is valid but there is much more to straight line performance. The Mustang GT has it's lunch handed to it by the others in the quarter mile and in the triple digits. Take a look at the Car & Driver story. The 0-140mph times are 22.3 seconds, 27.7 seconds and the GT might as well give up at 34.2 seconds. These are enormous gaps at triple digit speeds. Who drives that fast and where you ask? Well considering the 60-130mph measurement is becoming the new standard, if you're still asking, you're not in the market for a 400hp car, are you? http://www.examiner.com/x-5826-San-Jose-Autos-Examiner~y2009m3d21-New-performance-standard-of-60mph-to-130mph-replacing-the-quartermile-drag-race

The bottom line is when the top model warrants a comparison, bring in the heavy hitters, not the price leaders. Once you have that resolved, drive 'em to their ability just like your competition and the owners themselves.

Photo: The 2010 Mustang GT at 315hp is quick, but is Car & Driver's top pick despite being the slowest, by far. http://www.desktopcar.net/ford/mustang/Ford_Mustang_2010_01.jpg.html

The Key for more viewers of SpeedTV and Koni Challenge Racing

SpeedTV televised the Koni Challenge Series at Daytona in Florida. The same reoccurring problem with racing coverage was evident for this race. However, it is even MORE essential in this series! Why? Because these cars are the closest to what is sold in the showrooms and driven on the street.

If viewers can't understand how cars can compete against one another, the interest will diminish. If SpeedTV would give a review of each car with some details and Grand-Am provided some information, the viewing audience will grow.

Racing is the most expensive sport in the world. Many can only dream to race, let alone at a professional level. Even a "track day" is about $200 plus thousands of miles taken off the life of brakes and tires. These performance cars being televised are sold based on their abilities. When obvious disparities are reduced and these various cars compete against one another head-to-head, the viewer must be informed how this is done. Not only that, many owners want to make street-legal modifications to their cars to make them closer to what is being raced. Faster is better, right?

The following cars were racing each other: Ford Mustang GT, previous generation BMW M3 with a 333hp 6-cylinder engine, current generation M3 with a 414hp 8-cylinder, a Dodge Challenger SRT-8 with 425hp but a very heavy, large car; Porsche 997 - the quintessential race car. Unmodified, the Porsche and V8 BMW would dominate the rest, hands down. And these are just the "GS" or Grand-Sport class cars:http://grand-am.com/koni/schedule/results.cfm?eid=877

In NASA, these cars are spread over 3 to 4 classes due to how much of a difference they are in performance:
http://www.nasaproracing.com/rules/Performance-Touring-rules.pdf

While the names of the drivers and teams is good information that must be provided, it is equally or more important for the masses to understand what makes this racing possible.